1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Super Charger Build

Discussion in 'Performance' started by spaner, Jan 21, 2010.

  1. spaner

    spaner Well-Known Member

    Say hello, to my little friend...

    ...


    Big foot, Wallace;

    Man, these meats are big, and heavy. About twice as much as the originals. They were 20" 155s; these are 23.6" 195 55r 15" KUMHO Wisk 119s (STUDDED) with some "winter steelies" from Can Tire.

    Say hello to my little friend... :D

    [​IMG]

    As I was pulling out of the shop, for the second trial run, "Spun" the rears and left some scratch marks in the newly layed concrete and took the paint off the new floor (studs). The old man is going to be pissed...

    Anyway, hot-wired the honeywell sensor so that I could do some "road-trials" with the system to date. No meth, just the basic charger, to see what's what. :pop:

    Truck rides like it's on rails with the new "square" type meats but has a lot of "ping" through the gears; this is with the standard 87, basic Canadian grade. Loaded up with some 97 (best we can get here) and lost the "ping" from gears 1 through 2.5...Not a lot of "load" there anyways...could almost eliminate first gear...

    As soon as I put a load on the third gear...loss of pwr and "ping"...
    Definitely a situation for the water/meth, and just a confirmation for the system.

    Just the same, the truck used to run like....a golf cart.
    Now it runs like a fork-lift...on steroids.

    A hell of a fun ride none the less;:D the honeywell sensor does it's job perfectly...put 40km on it...with some hiyway driving, up to 100kph.

    The super charger is as loud as hell, but does not even get warm...:confused:...thought it would...

    I'll tackel the water meth, next week...

    Any suggestions for recording video from the cab?
    Steer with the right and shift with the left...where's the camcorder?

    Greg, you're Auto, dosen't count...;)


    ...
     
  2. fupabox

    fupabox Well-Known Member

    steer, shift,signal with the left..video in the right.....it's a tiny bit less efficient though..A bit slower going through the gears ,when you want a hand back on the wheel before you hit th gas again
     
  3. spaner

    spaner Well-Known Member

    One step at a time...tuning

    ...


    I've learned a few more things over the last 72hr...:cool:

    1) the water meth method of controlling octain level "for ping", works perfectly.
    I mis spoke before when I said that I had loaded up with 97, it was actually 91. From 87 to 91, ping was reduced by 10%. With the addition of 4cc/minute of 49/51 water meth, ping was reduced by 60% of the remainder. At 12cc/minute, ping was reduced by 95%.

    2) You can not eliminate stock tuning components, namely vacuum lines, and expect to be able to tune to just rich of peek EGT (max pwr). The adjustable air jet will no longer fall within that envelope.
    Some of these lines are made to suck air.
    Namely 1) EPA fuel vent recovery, and 2) especially, the air box line, which not only controls the hot air flapper valve, but is, in itself, a tuned air flow line, having been placed into the MAF of the intake plenum. As MAF increases, an additional amount of AIR is introduced directlly to the manifold.
    Burning a lot of fuel? Do you have your stock air cleaner?
    Makes a HUGE differance in the mixture.

    Having said all that. Everything was put back as it should be. Tuned correctlly, and back out onto the road. Deffinetly did the trick. So well infact that the S/C belt "cherped" and BP went WAY, above the level that I should be getting, "ping" returned.

    "Exhaust...anyone..anyone...Bueller?"

    3) Exhaust Back pressure
    Boosting with a supercharger VS a turbocharger, exhaust back pressure needs to be eliminated by, at least, an equal amount of the boosted MAF.
    No "spooling" pressure required here.
    A 50% increase in MAF would require a 50% increase in exhaust flow? :pop:

    Thanks for reseaching the parts dmerc, looks like just what I need...and only $50...:D


    ....
     
  4. fupabox

    fupabox Well-Known Member

    Haha...silly me ....I just assumed that the exhaust wasn't any longer stock......that $50 is going to be the cheapest 10hp you'll ever get:):pop:
     
  5. spaner

    spaner Well-Known Member

    ...


    More Fupa, more...
    I don't know anything about exhaust tuning, just learning, but I know that the stock systems are already restricted to meet the HP restriction of the manufacturers. I don't know a lot about it so I did like a lot here have suggested to others for exhausts, I went to the local Midas, where I know an "old timer" runs the place.

    He was totally "into it" (his buddy has a Honda Mini), and he's worked with side by sides, he reminded me of that sergeant from Platoon with the cigarette...

    "Na, na, na...you're going about it all wrong..." :confused:
    "What you want to do is work backwards...it's like, we know that a 5" pipe is too big"
    This is after I gave him all the details...
    "A Walker 331?...that's too small for a supecharger to breath through"
    "You want it to make power, don't you? What size is the flange off the manifold...or..you want me to make you a header, and do it right?"
    Well..., I said, I think that the stock exhaust manifold should be OK for the job, mabe just go a bit larger with the pipe, after the catalytic converter?
    "A Cat?...I can't work with no Cat."
    Well..., I said, mabe I could...
    "Listen" he says..."Next week, I'll put aside the whole day, just bring it in first thing in the morning....and when it comes in the shop, I don't want to see no Cat...just leave the O2 sensor hanging there, we'll fix that up and we'll see about that flange size, I'm thinking 2", but we'll see."
    Ahhh, OK, I said, so, next week I'll bring that in, and you can get it so...
    "Yea, we'll fix it up, just do like I said and we'll take care of it."


    I walked out of there saying "yea, that guy knows more than I do."

    I just love it when people know what they're doing...:cool:


    ...
     
  6. Harley

    Harley New Member

    Busy with work atm! But work is really fun for me so life is good;)

    Your work/modifications are awesome btw, respect.

    The real test for the alternator will be under full load at night, lights on, stereo on, powering up a hill, with the engine at 5k rpm and the belt orbiting under it's own inertial. I always thought it could be good to have an electronic cutout switch for the alternator when the engine is under full load, e.g. @ WOT or under peak boost. That would increase engine efficiency and remove the belt slip problem for you under full load, just a thought.

    Cheers
    Harey
     
  7. fupabox

    fupabox Well-Known Member

    I seem to recall a similar set-up to what Harley is talking about....alt cut out and second battery coming on at WOT....so no alt drag and 24v to the ignition and fuel pump...reverts to 12v at anything other than WOT.....can't recall exactly how it was set up but was used in road racing back in the 1960s-70s.....the ignition and pump can handle the short bursts of 24v without any issues...I'll try and find some more info on it ...been a long time since I read the tech article on it
     
  8. spaner

    spaner Well-Known Member

    ...


    Thanks for the imput guys. Yea, I'm going to have to think about that a little while, after I have some hard miles on it and see what is really needed. Right now I think I'd like to do all three options. Just to stretch the project a little more. ;)

    Exhaust Update:

    This little mini-mod is going well. My plan was to take everthing apart, learn what it's all about, and put it back together with lots of never-seize so that I know more than they do, when it gets into Midas, and, I'm not paying shop time for broken studs etc.

    Now I know that buddy was right, you can't work with the Cat...

    [​IMG]

    There's no point in putting an 1 3/4" muffler on the 1 3/4" exhaust pipe...if the Cat exit pipe is only an 1 1/4"....not going to do anything...

    The exhaust manifold flange is a whole different story...

    [​IMG]

    Lot's of room here, to do whatever you want...3 1/4"...
    Custom flange is being fabed up for next week. With plans for a 2" exhaust from front to back...

    I did clean out the Cat before I put everthing back together, but there was nothing wrong with it. Not blocked.

    [​IMG]

    I did take it out onto the road and could just..notice a slight difference in performance, but almost no difference with "cleaning out" the Cat...
    It's that 1 1/4" Cat outflow oriface, just too restrictive to work with...

    It'll ALL be in the garbage can by the end of next week...
    [​IMG]


    ...
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2011
  9. spaner

    spaner Well-Known Member

    Exhaust is done...

    ...


    Dun, dun, duaaa...

    That's where that 10 hp was hiding...:D
    Took the boys 2hr and 20 minutes, front to back. Brand new 2" exhaust off the manifold. Very clean, very proffesional job. One hard mount and two soft mounts; tail pipe out the left side, behind the rear left tire...future rear bumper consideration.

    Put it this way, prior to mod, idle was set @ 1000...after mod, idle was @ 1500. Prior to mod, "ping" control required 12cc/minute @ WOT...after mod, "ping" control required 4cc/minute @ WOT...talk about back pressure.


    [​IMG]

    Now I can "spin" the studded 15s in 1st and 2nd...:D
    AND; prior to ANY modification, with my Titan 489s 24-12s...top speed was 60kph, truck would not go any faster...now, no top speed limit...SCARY..:eek:

    Demo'd the truck for some friends, just after, and their only comment?
    SOUNDS WICKED!

    I can post some more "new" exhaust pics if anyone is interested, but as far as I'm concerned, not my work, but respect for this vendor; nice job guys.


    Time to take a break...

    [​IMG]



    Next week, the fun continues...:pop:


    ...
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2011
    Ironraven likes this.
  10. Ironraven

    Ironraven Active Member

    Yeah. So... when you release the kit let me know and I'll buy one rotfl!!!
     
  11. spaner

    spaner Well-Known Member

    ...

    The "Interceptor" is about 2/3rds done and you guys have been pretty good, so common, let's go for a ride...[​IMG]


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPnEOe0uaq8


    Hammered Down (WOT) twice, on the way back, in 4th, never saw 5th, on this run...
    Mostly 60ish, on the twisty part, and 70ish on the main road...

    ...
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2011
  12. fupabox

    fupabox Well-Known Member

    damn it you always post these on nights I am at work and youtube is blocked :frustration::frustration::frustration::frustration::frustration::)
     
  13. spaner

    spaner Well-Known Member

    ...


    Ha, ha...I just happen to be up tonight, "BORED", and posted from my mini truck channel stash...

    You don't work at the OCC do you?

    Just a strait "street" run anyway, fun as hell though...

    Project should be done by June, sometime...


    ...
     
  14. fupabox

    fupabox Well-Known Member

    Nope not OCC

    at 1:00 when you are behind the ram making the left the throttle blip is sweet:) the cabs of these minis have horrible acoustics at anything over a crawl..they seem to destroy sound recording...love to hear the 2" exhaust from the outside.. how do you find the ride with the low prof. tires?....tire pressure?...I found a huge difference in ride dropping to 26psi from 28-30......I tried 36psi just for giggles and the handling was terrifyingly bad:) not to mention the ride
     
  15. spaner

    spaner Well-Known Member

    The ride is not bad at all but it would prob improve with a little drop in psi; giving up a little performance and more fuel...nothing compared to just having these big meats on anyway. I had the camcorder mounted to the pasenger headrest bar with a bunch of elastic bands. Seemed solid enough, but in the video, bumps and shakes are magnified quite a bit...it was really a fairlly smooth ride.

    That sound blip you mentioned at 1:00, happens every time I went to WOT, but that was the only time that the camcorder "picked it up". Not sure how to fix that?
    Like when I turned around, to come back, I spun the rears from gravel to pavement, making a hell of a racket, but all you hear is static..then the sound kicks back in, shifting into second gear??

    Same thing happened both times I went to WOT in fourth gear, on the way back. You can tell cus the picture starts to shake, and things get faster, but the sound goes to static?

    Next time I think I'll try it with the windows open...
     
  16. spaner

    spaner Well-Known Member

    ...


    So, I've got few hundred K on the "Interceprer" now and I'm about ready to "turn up the boost". How can I do this? You might ask...one step at a time...tuning...
    I've been adjusting the mixture, water/meth, exhaust back pressure...etc. Getting everything "dialed in", ping control, occtain level, under boost...
    Things are looking GOOD. I've been boosting between 2 to 4 PSI...but, I had not put any check valves on the two vacuume lines off of the intake manifold...so I've been "bleading" boost...about 3 more PSI, GOING, to be added...not yet...
    BUT...
    After a hard run yesterday, 30km @ WOT and FULL BOOST, at night, I pulled up to an intersection....and the truck had only 1/3rd PWR from that point on????
    Seemed to be running on 2 of the 3 cylinders, checked everything, one component at a time, all looked good.

    Tell me what is wrong, what component has failed. Have I destroyed this engine? Have I gone "too far"?

    Starts normal, runs a little ruff, very little PWR, "smell of gas"....:pop::pop::pop:

    No bangs, no grinds..nothing...nothing...:sly:


    ...
     
  17. fupabox

    fupabox Well-Known Member

    what heat range and gap spark plugs did you use ? I think you have burned out/fouled a plug or two
     
  18. Ironraven

    Ironraven Active Member

    I'd pull your plugs and let them sit overnight so any excess gas can evaporate out, then I'd replace your plugs with some a step cooler (cooler plugs for boost is pretty standard) and try again. If you killed the engine with boost it'd be messy and wouldn't run.
     
  19. spaner

    spaner Well-Known Member

    ...


    Pulled the plugs, 1 and 2 are normal, 3 is totally fouled..kleened it up, rotated the positions...restart , no change, checked the cap and rotor, no change, pulled plugs again..1 is fouled 2 is ok 3 is fouled......getting worse...
    :pop::pop:


    ...
     
  20. spaner

    spaner Well-Known Member

    Testing 1, 2, 3...

    ...


    THIS HAS BEEN A TEST, JUST A TEST....:cool:
    Not enough players though...:(

    Thanks for the tries though guys. I actually tracked down the culprit the next morning. Pretty easy to see the problem once it "surfaced" and I could look for "something", but you can see from the pic that this has been sapping engine power for some time. Leads 1 and 2 are not as bad but still, they do have carbon tracks. New set is in the mail.:pop:


    [​IMG]

    and, yes, that is burned right through...

    I'm starting to add horses now, one at a time. Boost-Up, next week.:rolleyes:



    ...
     

Share This Page