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Epa News Cold Hard Facts

Discussion in 'EPA Regulations' started by BIG DADDY, Oct 29, 2008.

  1. canadian1

    canadian1 Member


    thank you; you are right on track. i to am a 38 year firefighter veteran.
  2. mc22958

    mc22958 New Member

    Lets play devils advocate for a sec. You are driving your mini truck on the road and by somebody Else's fault you are in an accident. (you were driving defensively and were blind-sided) Since your truck doesn't have air bags you hit your head on the windshield. The at fault drivers insurance is bare bones and you were hurt pretty bad. Your hospital bills go beyond the insurance coverage and you are out of work for weeks. Well, you have a good insurance company and it picks up the difference. You now go out and buy another truck and motor happily down the road, besides having that slight persisting pain in your neck. (embellishing I know)
    Now who lost here? Well you did. Most probably your insurance will go up since they had to pay out. You lost your truck and had to get another one,and with the new regs, it ended up costing you more.
    But it also cost me. The rescue vehicles that responded and transported you to the hospital cost money. If your county doesn't recoup that amount from the insurance company, or you, then the taxpayers pay for it. (If you were in a better equipped auto you might have refused transport because you wouldn't be hurt) This accident will be registered in the data base at the insurance companies. If they determine that accident injury rates in your area are higher then they may raise rates across the board for everybody. Now everybody's insurance goes up.
    Now lets say you didn't have insurance and you turned out to be a paraplegic. (I pray this doesn't happen) You now cant work and go on disability. Now the taxpayers are paying for that too.
    As you can see it is to everybody's benefit to have the most up to date safety equipped vehicles on the road. We do not live in a bubble, each to our-selfs. Our actions and those of others effect all of us.

    I am not saying you shouldn't drive your truck on the road but you should be aware that your actions, or lack of such, may effect others.
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2008
  3. Timetripper

    Timetripper Moderator

    So anything smaller than a Hummer H2 should'nt be on the road by that logic and along with any older vehicle that does not have air bags and don't forget the motocycles while were cleaning things up.

    I have never smoked either so maybe we should get rid of all the smokers who end up getting sick and cost us money as well [I am being totally sarcastic BTW]

    Seriously though
    I thought that was one of the cornerstones of democracy - being able to do things "freely" and being able to agree to disagree with out fear of being locked up by the government for your views.

    I have never owned and probably never will own a motorcycle but don't mind at all the people who ride them or the freedom and enjoyment they get from them and likewise with anyone who owns and drives a kei truck on either side of the border on-road.

    After having read through most of the posts on this "EPA" subject the only thing I think would be fair [?] is if they [government] collected the 25% duty that would have been charged if they were brought in as on-road vehicles in the first place but it is a messy situation all the way around with no easy answers IMO
  4. mc22958

    mc22958 New Member

    Timetripper, No the simple logic is that the mini trucks do not have the safety equipment the other vehicles on the road, year compared to year, are required to have. Not to mention the EPA guidelines.
  5. Timetripper

    Timetripper Moderator

    Most early 90's vehicles don't have airbags I know my 1992 Ford E-350 doesn't.
    I know here in Canada if it wasn't for a certain lobby group I could drive a newer kei truck
    with ABS and Airbags but the newest you can bring in is 15 yrs or older and none of that technology was available on a '91
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2008
  6. gregw98

    gregw98 Member

    Maybe true, but they are still safer than 2 wheel and 3 wheel motorcycles.

    I said this before, but how is it that you can build a 32 Ford Hot Rod with a Chevy engine and no pollution stuff and it can be totally street legal. I truly beleive that lobbist are 100% behind this whole new 'crackdown'.
  7. myazel

    myazel Member

    As stated earlier I have been in Fire/Rescue over 30 years and there is no doubt new cars are much safer and eveiormentally freindly than they were twenty years ago. That however does not mean we send every vehicle more than two years old to the crusher. A few hundred thousand Minis running around this country should be the least of our worries. Over half of the accidents we work each year someone involved is not legal, no license, no insurance or not a citizen of this country. Get the drunks off of the road even just ones without licenses would help and then the illegals and then we can talk. Some guy running around in a mini between farms is the least of my worries. The kids running 100 mph at 1 am on Saturday morning in a 3 ton double cab truck are the guys I am getting real tired of cleaning up after. Look at real statistics before you start speaking and you will have your eyes opened to the real problems that Police and Rescue face instead of the ones dreamed up by our polititions.
  8. gregw98

    gregw98 Member

    Amen, Myazel.
  9. Timetripper

    Timetripper Moderator

    Nice post myazel
  10. jtpc

    jtpc Member

    Well spoken, Myazel.

    And as a side note, I believe the later model Honda Actys have 2 airbags.
    And my subaru has one for the driver. :)
    Not too bad. And these little guys do have seat belts, as someone mentioned, overall are safer than motorcycles. (plus these little guys won't be caught going 100+MPH as most motorcycles do so quickly without getting caught around here)
    So keeping these little trucks slower (55mph and less) definitely reduces their chances of a high-speed collision.
  11. Timetripper

    Timetripper Moderator

    jtpc, Does your '01 have ABS brakes?
  12. dmerc

    dmerc Member

    That could be said of ANTHING. A rider on a horse, kid on a skateboard....toddler on a tricyle, anything where your actions could cause someone to swerve and hit a tree, or another car.

    We have Amish around my area, and they'll be riding home in their buggies in the middle of the night, pitch black, with only a small flashing light on back. I've come close to plowing into 'em several times.

    Ya' just gotta' let folks lead their life, and hope for the best.

    Accidents WILL happen, but having ridden motorcycles for almost 40 years, I've never wrecked onroad, and I know why......with no safety equipment, you've GOT TO BE CAREFUL!! I drive my Carry the same way......I know if I hit something hard,and headon, my legs/feet are in real trouble, most likely Gone!:eek: THAT, makes me VERY careful!!
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2008
  13. jtpc

    jtpc Member

    Very true.
  14. mc22958

    mc22958 New Member

    Boy I am getting beat up here... The only point I have is to know your options and the possible consequences of your actions. After you know these then you can make a well informed decision. That is it. Personally I drive a Jeep with a very good winch bumper, front air bags, side air bags, ABS, traction control, stability control and more.....

    Accidents are called accidents because that is what they are.
  15. dmerc

    dmerc Member

    I have a Jeep too, an 08 Unlimited 4dr. I've driven it twice in the last 6 months. I ALWAYS take my Bandit everywhere. But, the 5am trips to work are getting mighty chilly!:D I had planned on driving the Carry as often as possible, but with gas under $2 again, I reckon I should get the Jeep out, and blow the cobwebs out.:D

    BTW, Didn't mean to beat you up, just saying that if you think worse case scenario, you can imagine a horrific outcome from ANY possible circumstance.
  16. Doug Waggonner

    Doug Waggonner New Member

    Someone is blowing smoke up someones ***! There is NO WAY the epa can put 2008 emmisions standards on any truck or car that was built before 2008. No way no how. Thats the biggest load of crap I've ever heard for blaming it on the states that legally allow Kei trucks to be driven on road.
    I'll get off my soap box now.
  17. boosted mitsu

    boosted mitsu Member

    according to the EPA agent that i spoke to it will be 2008 emission standards for non-road vehicles.
    i dont think it will be that bad. plus they have told me that they will be pushing the dead-line till sometime next year
    the new regulations are due out any day now. all mini's that were imported will be grandfathered in. this is according to the agent at the EPA.
  18. Doug Waggonner

    Doug Waggonner New Member

    I agree with that. But keep in mind this will be emmisions requirements for 2008 and newer. 2007 and older are grandfathered. And since the great state of Oklahoma, and other states allow these on the roads, they will not have to follow the "off road use only" policy in those states.

    And just out of couriosity, does anyone know the EPA equivelent of Euro III or IV emmisions? Is it Tier 3 or 4? If it oes work this way, this issue may already be solved.
  19. mc22958

    mc22958 New Member

    The way I understand the guidelines it is how the mini truck will be classified. If it is re-classified as a "side-by-side" atv or a "off road" atv then the change in status makes it new. Since it is now new, (I know it is actually a used truck), it has to pass that years standards for the ATV's. The year its classification was changed and brought into service. On the other hand if they are brought in as used passenger truck they will have to follow both the DOT and EPA guidelines. This can be done but may prove to be too expensive. Back in the 80's this was done all of the time to bring in luxury and performance cars. But todays standards are much tougher.
    I could be wrong but that is my take on it.
  20. gregw98

    gregw98 Member

    Didn't Boyd Coddington get into it with the Feds for selling his resto rods as new vehicles and the Govt. said they can't be classified "As New" because the were actually older vehicles refurbished. But "new" is "New" , like brand new. Coddington lost, the G-men said a vehicle manufactured years ago and use could not be classified as "New". So Boyd had to change the listings on his refurbed rest rods to say "Used". Feds need to make up their minds as to what "new" means and what "used" is.
    New is new, used is used -----period.
  21. Timetripper

    Timetripper Moderator

    I think the peeps in question do what ever suits them at the time. :D
    I agree with you a 100%, especially in Boyd's case - lots of times the only thing orginal from the donor car was the chrome emblem for the model of the car.
  22. Mini4WD

    Mini4WD Member

    Actually Boyd pled guilty in 2005 for registering new custom-fabricated cars as antiques to avoid emissions and taxation laws. He was buying counterfeit titles for 30's and 40's era cars and assigning them to his new custom fabricated cars. I always liked watching his show...He was a master of Hot Rodding and if not for him, there probably wouldn't be a Chip Foose...

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