I was wondering about how to get more axle articulation, especially in the rear. For those who might be wondering, like when you cross a ditch at an angle you end up with one or two tires in the air. Increased axle articulation (or increased wheel travel) would allow you to get across uneven terrain without a tire lifting as much or any. Anyhow, I was wondering about making/retrofitting something like this in the rear for shackles on the springs? http://www.trailquest.com/teraflex/revolver_shackles.shtml Does anybody else have any ideas? I don't think that there is much we can do in the front as far as wheel travel??
FWIW i'm very heavily involved in the jeeping comunity. those revolver shackles are the biggest waste of time and resources. even rock crawlers think they are absolute crap. they go over center and collapse on you. (i'm an avid rock crawler but run coil springs not leaf springs) the revolver shackle is (poorly) designed to give better articulation at full droop (suspension extension) and at full stuff (suspension compression). this is all based on the fact that the leaf spring, having two parallel pivot points, will not allow the axle to articulate as wells as a coil sprung (or coil overs for that matter) suspension system will. the matter of articulation typically comes into play when you have the SOA (spring over axle) suspension with a minimum of 4" of lift or so. i see a lot of jeeps that are "mall crawlers" they are just concerend with how much height they have not about the performance on the trail or rocks. the teraflex revolver shackle is a gimmick at best. like i said it has more flaws than benefits. if you are looking for some lift just build or buy a simple set of shackles for your desired amount of lift, but save your money on the revolvers and put it towards something that works.
I agree with Mighty Milt. To add... I would solve the problem with a locker. Articulation isn't as critical if you have a locker. When and if i ever get enough money together for buying one of these little trucks, it will be my off road adventure platform. Though if i was gonna go full up rock crawler, i would start with another vehicle as a base (solid axles, coil over suspension). But i go off road for the purpose of getting places that are hard to access. I do not go for the purpose of finding obstacles to break my equipment on that go no where in particular or have an easy bypass. Weaknesses of these vehicles for offroad include;Independent Front suspension. No upper control arm (MacPherson Strut design). Rear suspension is Leaf not coil. Probably not much articulation to speak of. Advantages. Cheap vehicle to purchase, modify, and repair. VERY small wheel base. More stock ground clearance than some 4x4 SUV's (yep isnt that sad?)
a locker will engage both wheels on the same axle instead of running peg legged. my junk has a locker up front and a live axle in the rear (spool, no differential, both rear wheels spin together all the time, noise on the street and screeches the tires all the time) if you have a locker and don't have the suspension travel or "articulation" you will just get stuck on obstacle with both wheels spinning rather than just one when you have an open diff. if you look at the pictures below it is a good example of articulation as well as where locked axles come in handy. when you have an open diff it will allow the tire with the least traction to spin. without a locker i wouldn't have been able to get up on this "obstacle" i tried before i had lockers... and without articulation i could't get up there before either. btw, these were the test pix for the new 4.5" lift on it - wanted to see how well it flexed
"if you have a locker and don't have the suspension travel or "articulation" you will just get stuck on obstacle with both wheels spinning rather than just one when you have an open diff. " Having poor articulation with a locker does not increase your chances of getting "high centered" or "hung up" if that is what you are suggesting. If you are suggesting that the lack of having traction from both tires on the ground would cause "both tires to spin" I would agree that having the suspension travel would be of use in this situation. If i had to pick one or the other. I would go with locker any day of the week. If i didn't, i would have both without question.
the point i was trying to make is that if you have a locker, but don't have the suspension to handle the terrain, or the ground clearance to handle the terrain you will be just as stuck (if not in a more difficult place to be recovered from) as if you had an open diff. i speak from experience. when my jeep was mostly stock, i got stuck on a lot of the trails and had to be pulled out/off of obstacles several times. one of my first upgrades was a locker up front. and it helped me to feel like i could make it further on the same trails but in fact i just got "more stuck" and had to be pulled off/out of my predicaments. luckily i never wheel alone. as i got more lift and got my jeep locked front and rear i just ended up on tougher trails that necessitated a whinch to make it through. that doesn't say much about the ability of my rig when i end up winching through rather than driving through... i can drag a dead horse through a trail on a rope but it doesn't mean the cowboy rode him. check out my trials and tribulations
Totally agree. I’ve been in the sport for about 2 years now and I have to temper my "arms race" approach to "conquering the trail" b/c as you mention, you upgrade and you only end up on a tougher trail, getting more stuck, further from civilization! Personal lessons learned; The more capable your vehicle, the farther away from help you will be when you get stuck. Doh! Been there done that. Know what the vehicle can and can’t do based on features like ground clearance, drive train configuration, articulation, winches, approach, break over, departure angles, skid plates. Know how to balance these features against trail conditions. Judgment in this area is an evolution based on experience. Don’t just assume, well I have a locker so I can just kamikaze that boulder field up there and I’ll be fine. Know what your body can and can’t do, bring appropriate food, water, medical supplies, emergency shelter clothing, etc. Stay home if you are ill NEVER! Leave anyone behind! All for one, one for all out there!
I have about 5 miles of trails outside my back door that the kids and I drive on. These are just trails through the woods with quite a few creek crossings. I was looking for a way to increase articulation so that when I cross those creek crossings I do not have a problem with wheels being up in the air (as much). Thank you for your discussion, sounds like the terraflex shackle thingy is out. My 1999 Mitsubishi U62T has a 3 inch lift. The front has the strut spacers and piece of square tubing. The rear has a shackle extension of about 5-6". On another post someone mentioned scrapping that kind of lift on the rear for an add a leaf? But wouldn't an add a leaf make the suspension stiffer and give even less articulation?
add a leaf will, in fact, make it stiffer and limit articulation. the key to articulation is down travel. that is to say that you need a stiff enough spring to hold you up, but you need to be able to let the axle drop away from the frame pretty far. i know guys with larger lifts than i have with more articulation and their (coil) springs come completely unseated and will drop 5 or 6 inches away from the perch and ride on a tube so they re-seat as the axle travels back up. considering that a 3" lift up front is maxed out for the cv drive angle, i would say you aren't going to get much articulation at all. i have several pix of my mini on a berm that my jeep would easily articulate and crawl over, but the mini is on two diagonal wheels and won't go anyhwere.
Had a Diesel KJ but it went kablewy (Engine and Tranny failure). Now i have a tacoma. Never went out with virtual jeep club, not my style. LOST Kj's mainly. Cant find many action shots, was too busy driving. But heres a few random shots from the photobucket. Carnage at sunflower mine. Me testing the "then new" lift kit and testing my flex south end of white tank mountains off watson rd. Jeep Glam
Do a "coil over suspension" conversion in the rear for your mini! 1/2 kidding. Someone in this forum bought some very cheep trailer leaf packs for thier mini. Maybe there is somthing out there that would suffice for increasing articulation that way. Contrary to why they got them, which i believe, was to increase cargo capacity.
Leaf springs aren't always bad i have them in the front of my rock buggy and i kick the crap out of alot of you jeep guys and your coils im in the process of 4 linking the rear of my carry and running fox air shocks
A "MINI" 4 link system and a set of "helper air springs" is the way to go. A rear inter-connect pressure line system will give you all the articulation you can handle. ....if that is what you are looking for...
Longer leafs will have more range of travel, there for will flex better. So either put longer leafs or convert over to a link coil suspension in the rear.
