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Cold weather starts

Discussion in 'Subaru Sambar' started by Rural, Nov 5, 2008.

  1. Rural

    Rural Member

    We were down to about -5C last night and my Sambar struggled to start. Since Colin can brag about his truck starting fine at -35C, I figure I might be able to do better than the status-quo.

    I'm sure that the timing is very close to spot-on, but the air filter is pretty dirty (should get a replacement early next week), there is probably still some moisture in the fuel tank (fuel drier for the next couple fills), but any other guesses as to what could be out of whack?

    Looking forward to getting an in-line rad hose heater in a couple of weeks too.
     
  2. Mighty Milt

    Mighty Milt Active Member

    we're having a cold snap here too! the temp dropped almost 20*F since last week, it was only 75* and i was scared my truck wouldn't start :rolleyes:

    i'm sooo glad days of scraping ice off windshields and praying my car would start in -10*c are far behind me...

    moisture in the fuel can certainly be a problem but it depends on how much is in there how badly it will affect it... one more suggestion might be to check your battery. you gotta have a good battery to stand up to those temps.
     
  3. Rural

    Rural Member

    I'm thinking that moisture in the fuel is the main contributor to the problem. When I drove in to work this morning, I was getting what seemed like a much milder version of the complete loss of power that happened the day I bought the truck. It was subtle enough that you'd miss it if you weren't paying attention.
     
  4. Mighty Milt

    Mighty Milt Active Member

    so, was your truck cranking steadily and just not lighting off?
     
  5. lee

    lee New Member

    Yup a little gas line antifreeze does wonders. cheap too (remember you only need a bit, becuase your tank is only 30 Litres)

    Has anyone been able to find a great battery for canadian winters. I can find decent 200-300 cold cranking amps. but nothing better in the size that fits the truck?
    ________
    Aprilia TX300
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2011
  6. cmaranto

    cmaranto Member

    Mounting a REAL battery

    We, as matter of standard procedure, remove the stock battery box and replace it with a battery box from:

    thehotrodcompany.com
    Stock # All76102

    This permits the use of a standard # 25 or # 26 battery with 700 cranking amps. We also increase the size of the ground and positive cables to at least # 8. We touched 24 degrees a week ago, and the converted trucks popped right over, no sweat.

    If you do not want to go through the trouble or expense, Tractor Supply here in Indy sells a Garden Tractor Battery with 430 cranking amps. They are labeled Briggs & Stratton, and have a fair amount of additional punch. But......we find that Garden Tractor batteries only last 2 years, so for 48.00 they are not a great buy. I standard 25 or 26 Duralast should go for 4 to 5 years, making them a better value.

    Chuck near Indy
     
  7. slimbad

    slimbad Member

    check here.......later, slim

    http://www.minitrucktalk.com/showthread.php?t=2348&page=2&highlight=battery
     
  8. Rural

    Rural Member

    It would light off, then sound like a 50-year veteran of chain-smoking. Sputtering and coughing, but alive with plenty of gas. After a bit of this (maybe 20 seconds), it would rev up and then idle fine afterward. After a few minutes of idling, off I went. Maybe it was just my imagination, but the truck seemed sluggish.

    This morning, it started just fine. The temperature didn't get below freezing, so that might be why. Maybe another fuel filter is in order.
     
  9. Mighty Milt

    Mighty Milt Active Member

    a weak battery can cause a weak spark and i've seen a weak spark mask it's self as lack of fuel. i've had to feather the gas pedal to get the rpm's up and thought i had fuel delivery problems, but it was an electrical fault.
     
  10. cmaranto

    cmaranto Member

    Weak battery

    Great point Milt. :) The batteries that these little guys come with from the Fatherland are usually 1 step from dying. Have had the same problem on two different trucks, and a fresh battery cured both. This is after a complete tuneup, fuel filter, and checking the flow of the fuel pump, float level etc.:frustration:

    Chuck near Indy
     
  11. confuzed

    confuzed Member

    Hey Rural mine does seems sluggish for the first few blocks if not warmed up too. I have been trying to figure out how to put an in line heater in the hoses too not sure tho as it would have to be able to circulate with thermostate closed but did notice that there is a heater hose as well as an out and in to the rad running the full length of the truck.Bought some 1/2 " foam pipe insulation to install this week on the heater line, it is the inside one of the three lines.I get very little heat if left idling but once it is running heat is good.If you figure it out before me let me know i want to run it all winter and let the one ton rest lol.The boys at work are harrassing me lol a chev 1/2 ton a ford 1 ton in the back alley and out front the sambar say it looks like an auto wreckers.
     
  12. Rural

    Rural Member

    Confuzed, let us know how the insulation goes. I'm curious whether it will get hot enough to melt, but think it will probably be fine.

    To all, good points about batteries. It's a couple lines down on my priority list, but it will happen.
     
  13. confuzed

    confuzed Member

    A couple weeks ago i insulated the wrong pipe the line to the rad and it hasn't melted yet lol and it should be the hottest one.
     
  14. Rural

    Rural Member

    We had fog all day yesterday and this morning, with temperatures just above freezing. Again, the truck had issues starting. Same as before, it required lots of gas to fire, and then about 10 seconds before it ran smoothly. I wonder if moisture in the air aggravates things more-so than temperature.

    I'm going to put a volt-meter to the battery and see if it needs replacing. Thanks for the suggestion.

    Changed the air filter late last week. Doesn't seem to make much difference, but I'm sure I'll detect an improvement in my fuel economy (which is bad at the moment, 10.2L/100km or about 23 MPG).

    Since I wanted to do it anyway, I changed the spark-plugs. The old plugs didn't look too bad. A bit of build-up on one, but the others were just "plated" in brown stuff.

    And I still haven't eliminated the fuel as the culprit. Been through a couple of tanks of gas with fuel drier additive, but the fuel filter eventually clogs up. I'm on the third one and the truck has started to act up again. Another will arrive at NAPA on Wednesday. As is, the truck does a less and less severe version of its loss of power thing from time to time (almost feels like driving into gusting wind), but not once it's warmed up.
     
  15. cmaranto

    cmaranto Member

    Hard starting in the cold

    I assume you know to hit the pedal once to set the choke if its a carbed engine.
    Do not underestimate the need for a new cap. Almost all the trucks we get have smoked caps (center carbon contact either completely gone or no spring tension).

    By the way, U42T caps are not spring loaded, but the rotors are. Carbon contact must still be in great shape.
    Chuck near Indy
    hoosierminitruck.com
     
  16. derekborne

    derekborne New Member

    In southern Manitoba we have been down to -10 C and my truck seems to start better than when it is nice out. I give it 4 pumps and she fires right away. I do need to hold the clutch in though. The tranny fluid is so thick in there that the truck lurches forward if I don't hold the clutch in. I am looking into putting some synthetic in there. I run 5W30 in the engine. I will probably put some synthetic in when I do my next oil change a it will be getting down to -40 here all to quickly. As for a heater, I have an inline heater but it is 1500 watts. I can't run it at work as we are regulated to 950 watts. I think I will purchase the zerostart heater from Cdn Tire. Good luck with your problems.
     
  17. Rural

    Rural Member

    Strictly speaking, nope. I didn't know that. Good tip.

    It's more the 30 seconds after starting that worries me...and the low fuel economy.
     
  18. Timetripper

    Timetripper Moderator

    It is quite possible that some uncaring person put the wrong fluid in the transaxle of your Sambar.
    Some clueless clucks think that 80W90 weight GL5 works in anything with gears - wrong.
    I switched to Redline MTL synthetic in my Sambar it it shifts way better than when I got it and the Redline is made to play nice with transaxles/ syncro's.
    Link to Redline page http://www.redlineoil.com/products_gearlubricants.asp?categoryID=7
    Note: It is the MTL GL4 70W80 oil not the GL5 based oils. Owners in hot climates should use the MT-90 GL4 75W90 which is a slightly heavier weight oil.

    Changing oil is a breeze - Drain/ Fill plugs both on LH side of transaxle just in front of were axle goes into it.
     
  19. confuzed

    confuzed Member

    I find mine needs three to the floor pumps and fires on a turn of the key sometimes it will stall but repeat and it is off and running .Also what fuel are u running? reg or premium? Strange as it may sound I tried premium and it ran rough went back to reg as is ok. Took to Red Deer today will check the insulation in the daylight, ha ha you know Antler Hill just north of Innifail?In freezing fog (wipers mirror headlight surrounds covered in ice) made it up at 95 kph and heater worked great.I also find important to let warm up or real lack of power.Derekborne which line did you tie into?
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2008
  20. confuzed

    confuzed Member

    hey i got the insulation on the right pipe lol ran it from three hills to red deer at 115 kmh no melting of the insulation now i need to fix the heater switch only works on high but at least the high works as a smoker the window is usually open part way so it works out but man the little vents at the top of the cab sure let in the cold air with the window cracked it will frezze ur butt:D looked down at the speedo once and almost freaked 125 kmh:eek: not a shake out of it that was with the japanese tires :rolleyes: so it was at full temp for about an hour and a half run
     
  21. Rural

    Rural Member

    I changed my fuel filter on Monday. It has started great ever since...except for when I pumped the gas pedal three times before turning the key. Definitely acted like it was flooded then. But with that exception, it's been fine.

    The battery sure doesn't have much oomph. When I was cranking it after my suspected flooding incident, it was starting to die as the engine caught.
     
  22. josh.e

    josh.e New Member

    I just did a fuel filter swap yesterday for the same issue.
    I've had progressively worse cold starts this week (around 0-3C and rainy), until yesterday it wouldn't start.

    New fuel filter seems to have done the trick. One pump to set the choke, and it started first try this morning.:)
     
  23. Samurai9

    Samurai9 Member

    My 1993 Hijet has been tough to start in the cold weather. My procedure had been to pump the gas once and then turn the ignition key with my foot off the gas. In the cold weather, I am finding that I need to pump a total of four or five times to get the choke going and the engine running.

    Sam
     
  24. confuzed

    confuzed Member

    Brrrrr Cold Starting

    Hey rural how u making out with the cold starts? I have found the colder it gets the less I pump.Usually open door turn key and it starts if not I give one pump and it will start,then run for the house door before I freeze.lol Still no inline heater and parked on the street.Seems real easy to flood when cold.
     
  25. Rural

    Rural Member

    My truck hasn't been running since December 27th.

    Before Christmas, we had pulled it into the garage and done some poking around, but hadn't really done any work. So I brought it back home and parked it outside. On the 27th, at about -15C, with the inline heater plugged in, it started after a bit of struggling. So I took my brother out for a drive (and suckered him into some chores). We did some highway driving, some gravel roading, some snow dogging (a hoot), some idling (while doing chores), then some more highway driving on our way home. As we pulled up to park, it stalled and wouldn't start. So we pushed it into the garage and figured it was time to drop the fuel tank and change the fuel. We've finished that, but managed to get some high-methanol fuel into the system (again). We've purged the fuel system except for the carb.

    I'm hoping to get it running this afternoon. That should be the end of my fuel problems. I figure my next focus will be the electrical system (which seems good except for the battery and possibly the points).

     
  26. Subaru

    Subaru Member

    Jeez Rural---I am wishing you had bought my silver AWD for $4000,that thing starts if it sees ya walking up to it dangling keys:D

    Hopefully you get yours figured out before your wife kicks you out for spending more time 'fixing that damn truck' than you spend with her:eek:--just kidding
     
  27. Rural

    Rural Member

    I've only got two afternoons and three evenings into this. Most of that was successful. Lately, I just haven't been able to get free time to coincide with availability of a heated garage. Time spent on the truck is way down on my wife's long list of complaints.

    Honestly, the problem isn't the truck... Well, it's got at least an issue or two, but it wouldn't matter what condition it was in when I got my hands on it. A few days of my poking around and experimenting and it wouldn't run. ;)

    There are no mysteries with its current state of non-runningness. Cranking on it when there was nothing but methanol in the tank was a...serious mis-step. ("Hey! Did we put the gas in yet? Uh-oh. Maybe that's why it won't start.")

    Seriously, I'm having a lot of fun with this.

     
  28. josh.e

    josh.e New Member

    I think I've got my cold start issue figured out, it was actually more of a "damp start" issue.

    After not starting for my wife yesterday morning, I decided to dig into it a bit. Two of the boots on my sparkplug wires had broken seals on the dist cap end.
    When I looked at these, they had moisture in them. I checked the spark on the coil, which looked really good. Then on all 4 cylinders, all were noticeably weaker than the coil and no. 2 and 4 (with the broken seals) were very weak.

    I pulled the cap to have a look, and all 4 points were pretty corroded. All 4 plugs were pretty saturated in gas when I took them out too, so I think the one pump to set the choke was enough to flood to the cylinders to the point that the weak spark wasn't going to ignite anything.

    Anyway, new dist cap, wires and plugs, and she's started up 1st crank two damp, rainy mornings in a row.(without setting the choke). I think my stalling in the car wash may have been the same problem.....

    While at Lordco, we figured out some cross reference part numbers: an NGK RC-SE93 plug wire set (off a 95 suzuki swift, I think it was). The coil wire was too long, but the plug wires are perfect. The cap is a Niehoff WA465D.
    My Van's a 1990 2WD carb'ed.
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2009
  29. Rural

    Rural Member

    Now that my truck is starting great, cold weather or not, I've been fine-tuning my starting procedure. I set the choke before turning the key, so the fuel system isn't up to pressure, then turn the key to on, put my seat-belt on while the fuel pump does its thing, then start it up.

    If I set the choke after the fuel system is pressurized, it takes two or three cranks to turn over instead of one.

    And thanks for the cross-references, I'll check whether they apply to me the next chance I get.
     
  30. boatman

    boatman Member

    ...well I've been waiting for the real cold to get here to see how this thing starts up in the morning. So far the worst was -23 C this morning... two pumps and turn the key and she fired right up. Died when I let out the clutch (in neutral), but started right up again. Let her idle for 30 secs then I was able to let out the clutch and shes fine.

    ...I'm a happy guy...

    bg
     

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